"Zionists all hate Palestinians and want to ethnic cleanse them."
Literally every Zionist and Jewish protest: 100k people singing songs for peace together
We don't want this war. Never did. We love being the only democracy and only safe state in the middle east for LGBTQIA+ folks. We love each other, love our Beduin, Druze and Muslim Israeli brothers and sisters. We want peace. But then Gazans behead our children while screaming "Yehud" (Jews) and the world denies it. Then there's war. #israel
@skaly Peace is not the same as justice, though. Apartheid South Africa was at peace until it wasn't (i.e. the organized resistance started fighting back). India under the British was at peace until it wasn't (Gandhi and others started organizing a coordinated resistance). Jim Crow US was at peace until it wasn't (MLK and Malcom X and others started organizing a coordinated resistance).
Peace does not mean justice. There needs to be justice and an abolishment to apartheid.
@chiraag
Sure, some areas had been occupied and there has been injustice acts I don't support.
With that said, almost all killing of Muslim individuals is not due to them "resisting". It's due to them committing terror. Besides Gaza is not occupied since 2005.
The West Bank have their own leadership and their police and our soldiers don't walk around there oppressing people - they only are present around the Jewish neighborhoods protecting them.
So, what apartheid are you talking about?
@skaly Your experience as a Jew in Israel does not negate investigations by human rights organizations also based in Israel and Palestine. So let me ask you: Do you dispute B'Tselem's and Yesh Din's findings and the facts in their reports?
@skaly Still waiting for your response on this. I've generally tried to make it a point to respond to your responses and I feel like I deserve at least that much respect, whether or not we agree on things.
So I will ask you again: Are you disputing the facts in the B'Tselem and Yesh Din reports?
@chiraag Jewish refugees were peaceful and have moved into empty lands mostly and bought loads of land from Palestinians. Later on, there have been territories occupied. Most of which had been given back, expelling thousands of Jews by the Israeli government out of their homes to give back territories for ceasefires, for chances of peace.Do you think I walk around asking Muslim folks to obey me or something? They are my equals by law and action. We study together, work together, marry each other
>> we are somehow supposed to support Jewish claims to the land based on the Torah and therefore we should be okay with the massive displacement, murder, and pillage that characterized the formation of the state of Israel?
Of all the issues in the long thread, this is the hill you want to die on?
You want to focus on #Zionism and #Kahanism, but the real story is much bigger.
The history of modern #MiddleEast is intricately tied to that of #BritishIndia, much more than people realize. India played an oversized role in the evolution of this region and it present problems.
If you are interested, I will tag you when I pull these threads together.
You have explicitly defended the long tirade by @chiraag, and my long thread is a response to much of the garbage in there.
You said you are a history nerd with an interest in "wicked problems" but it seems like you are already on your knees throwing up your hands in the air "This is a proxy fight"
This was not a problem in medieval times -- Palestine had been under #TurkishYoke since 1517. WWI finally brought them independence, as 1947 did to India.
In fact, it requires radical collaboration in an attempt to make it less worse.
There’s a solution, hand in hand, but it doesn’t involve Kahanism, Islamists, or Christian Dominionists making policy decisions and we’re not at all close to that.
>> In fact, it requires radical collaboration in an attempt to make it less worse.
Sure, but in order to reach a solution, you first have to acknowledge the problem — Here, the problem is not one of #independence, but one of #Jewish presence, as countless pieces of evidence show.
Also, to achieve collaboration, you must assign the blame on ALL blameworthy parties. The thread was bogus in just piling on #Jews & #Israel.
@rameshgupta@chiraag
Speaking only for myself, I don’t blame Jewish people for being the targets of terrorism.
To blame people of the Jewish faith for bad things that happen to them is simple anti-Semitism.
The diaspora was largely skeptical of the concept of Zionism until the Holocaust.
“Zion” was not a physical place until the 19th century; advocating for it implied that Jews could not or should not assimilate, which is an anti-Semitic idea.
The idea gained traction only because of surprise entry of #Turkey in #WWI.
Even after #BalfourDeclaration, #Britain offered Turkey an opportunity to stave it off because winning WWI was more important than Zionism. Turkey still refused!
You also missed that, since the First Temple period, Mount Zion has referred to the Temple Mount. The idea that Zion and Zionism didn’t refer to a specific place, when that place has been in our liturgy since the Babylonian exile, is generously stated to be creative and more appropriately an effort at Jewish erasure.
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