oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

Challenging question <https://peoplemaking.games/@eniko/110394794029226907>: was Google really responsible for killing off by phasing out ?
Those that follow me know that at least I for one put at least some weight on @mozilla <http://wok.oblomov.eu/tecnologia/opera-requiem-3/ and https://sociale.network/@oblomov/109902001164978888>, but I still disagree with @eniko's view.
Several in the comments there have already mentioned that alternatives to do exist, but two comments in particular hit (IMO) the nail in the head:

1/n

oblomov, (edited )
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

The first is this <https://mastodon.gal/@elrohir/110394829390259385> by @elrohir: what Google shutting off Reader achieved was to kill off the mindshare that RSS had accrued, turning it from “something every site should have” into “well, if Google is looking elsewhere, it mustn't be that important anymore” (similar thoughts are also reflected n @luigihann comment <https://mstdn.social/@luigihann/110395063216358522>)

2/n

oblomov, (edited )
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

As @j_bertolotti
<https://mathstodon.xyz/@j_bertolotti/110394825599883421> and several others (e.g. @blueminder <https://ohnoim.online/objects/5da265c4-dc54-4a2f-ae89-5f7b10c6a63c>, @rmrenner <https://mastodon.social/@rmrenner/110395005144474203>) remark, the Reader shutdown also removed the “social” aspect of RSS perusal, just as the general public attention was being corralled to centralized, ad-monetizable social networks —which probably also explains why the Reader was sunset: it went against the prevailing “attention economy”.

3/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

So I would argue that not only the shutdown of was the primary cause for the demise, but also this was actually intentional, to wipe out from the general consciousness the awareness of the possibility and existence of decentralized, user-controlled forms of content distribution.

Several users have also remarked that RSS and feeds still exist, citing podcasts as primary application (in fact, it could be argued that it's not a podcast if it's not available via RSS).

4/n

oblomov, (edited )
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

I'll add to that that there's another form of media that still heavily employs #RSS, and those that follow me won't be surprised by my mention of this: #webcomics.

A lot of self-hosted webcomic sites build on #WordPress, so RSS availability isn't a big surprise, but I appreciate that (or rather, when) dedicated hosting solutions also offer the feature. (#ComicFury does it, and even #WebToons, while AFAICS #Tapas does not.)

5/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

I use a self-hosted #ttrss to follow feeds, and the largest active (and still growing!) category is comics. The vast majority of the blog feeds I (used to) follow are either dead (as the hosting site shut down) or inactive, last updated some 10 years ago, with few exceptions (among which, the feeds from my own <http://wok.oblomov.eu/>).

(And for what it's worth, I still visit the original posts, even when the full article is available in the feed itself.)

6/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

And of course, #Mastodon and other #Fediverse platforms also support #RSS, as producers, as consumers, or both. Several news sites still have feeds too, even though they don't always link to them in any user-visible part of the page, or even at all (secret URLs FTW).

I think this underlines the importance of stating what exactly is meant by “Google Reader (or whatever else) killed RSS”, and why the mindshare aspect mentioned above is so important:

7/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

The technology is still alive, it's still being actively (and passively) used. Feeds are still being produced by a surprisingly large part of the Internet, and still being consumed, but the general public has been made unaware of this, to push the centralized social network paradigm of the attention economy.
I believe there might be an opportunity now, with the Twitter takeover bringing attention to the #Fediverse and rekindling interest in #POSSE and #PESOS, to reverse the trend.

8/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

And yes, as individuals this can be extremely frustrating, because the feeling is that even knowing what would be best to support the #openWeb, there's the feeling that our choice have little effect if any. And in this context, the non-ubiquitousness of #RSS production and consumption “where people gather” often means a need to double or triple the efforts to reach out and connect with other people with matching interests, especially for those whose livelihood depends on it.

9/n

oblomov, (edited )
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

I do have a feeling that we're approaching another paradigm shift: as the GAFAM enshittification progresses at increasingly rapid pace, times are getting ripe for the emergence of new contenders to the search engines and social silos that dominated the last 15 years, and ironically the strongholds of the old web are more likely to survive this change than anything that moved to the now sinking giants.

10/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

I'm not as optimist as others about the #openWeb and #indieWeb making a return comparable to the days of glory of the blogosphere, but I do have feeling that it will be a bridge, and those finding their space there will have an edge in whatever the new paradigm is going to be, even if it currently seems like a cause lost in the mist of unfriendly User Agents and single-user apps.

11/n

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

I'll take this opportunity to renew my plea to browsers that claim to be in favor of the #openWeb that it's way past the time you put your engineers where your mouth is, and get back into leading the adoption of open technology, instead of blindly following the “leader” in their destruction of the same —and not just when it's a matter of hype.

12/12

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

(And yes, that was really aimed at @mozilla as an invitation to bring back support in , and to openly promote instead of keeping it hidden in @FirefoxNightly, and more in general to go against everything that 's chokehold on the web currently represent. Support user choice instead of crippling it. Prove that you are different.)

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

(It's not over: see more here <https://sociale.network/@oblomov/110397020867065165>)

cybeardjm,
@cybeardjm@masto.ai avatar

@oblomov Have you checked the "Friends" plugin for WordPress, which is a kind of embedded RSS reader with some social interactions? It's still early of course...

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

@cybeardjm I don't use WordPress myself, so no. But the WP ecosystem is generally well oriented towards the open web. That Mozilla still hasn't restored RSS support in Firefox, instead, is worrisome.

cybeardjm,
@cybeardjm@masto.ai avatar

@oblomov I understand. Yes WP already moved towards the Fediverse and ActivityPub.
Friends is not an AP plugin, but can be enhanced by it, which is interesting, when your WP blog is already an AP instance.
https://wordpress.org/plugins/friends/

salyavin,

@oblomov
I use #ttrss as well I still have a number blog feeds believe it or not. Also news site rss. Some sites have nonobvious rss feeds like that paid newletter site you just add /feed on url end

gordwait,

@oblomov @mozilla @eniko

Interesting thread, my TLDR take is that Google Reader's social networking aspect was a key part in the success of RSS. I miss those days.

Could some sort of glue/adapter be used to connect RSS feeds with Mastodon as that missing social connection that Google Reader offered?

For the record, I use Feedly on a daily basis.

oblomov,
@oblomov@sociale.network avatar

@gordwait @mozilla @eniko There are federated platforms that can follow RSS feed, Friendica is probably the “biggest” name there. Mastodon could too, but AFAIK such a feature is deemed “out of scope” for the project.

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