Earlier, multiple sources had indicated that Xbox is looking to foray into third party development, with ports of several first party titles rumored to arrive on PS5 and Nintendo Switch 2
So I guess they know more about the next Switch console than the rest of us.
I would love to play some Gears of War on my PlayStation, but only if you could buy the physical game and not play through a subscription service like GamePass.
I am very pessimistic about that ever happening but i would love to be wrong. I dont think they have much incentive to make all those physical copies unfortunately
It would still be money into their account even if a subscription model might be better for them. But since, I wouldn’t be subscribing to anything related to Microsoft they would gain less money from me that way…
There’s no special sauce left in hardware. This last generation of consoles consisted of two computers and an Android tablet. The home boxes are whatever AMD could achieve within a $500 MSRP circa January 2020. Nothing to scoff at - but nothing amazing.
There is no need for separate consoles. It does not serve the consumer interest to have two incompatible releases of every single game. This isn’t a console war. It’s a format war.
Despite Sony’s success in past format wars, their position now is especially precarious. They don’t have a backup plan in this industry. Samsung ate their lunch. Their movie business looked shaky even before quarantine killed theaters. Music’s doing alright, somehow, despite nobody buying music. But their entire presence in the video-game industry, outside some first-party titles, is built on their blue computer being incompatible with Microsoft’s green computer or your actual PC. It is distinction without real difference. And where Microsoft can afford to “lose” any given generation - Sony can’t.
Sony is left desperately perpetuating the market structure that supported the PS2… when hardware shaped games. That’s been flipped backwards since the PS3 and 360. Multiplatform is god. Sony’s been coasting on momentum and popular fiction for almost twenty years. They’ve had some Nintendo-ish incomparables, like VR support, but they didn’t embrace that. Instead they chose to continue gambling on bribing developers for exclusives, and eventually outright buying studios.
Microsoft has always had the ability to undercut that. I’m only surprised it didn’t happen a decade ago. They kept hinting at it, with Xbox stuff on PC… but leave it to MS to show up late and not commit.
They tried for like a decade before finally giving up. Microsoft has learned a lot of lessons while trying to work on their gaming arm, and some of them have actually stuck. I would expect titles to be sold on Steam until Phil Spencer retires.
Looks like Microsoft is now entirely focusing on selling games rather than selling Xbox. I read somewhere that eventually they’ll bring the Game Pass to Play Station and Nintendo. It’s no surprise if they do so because last year they earned more money on Game Pass than selling hardware.
I wonder if Sony would allow gamepass in their ecosystem. That said, if this is true then we are likely to see Microsoft leave the console hardware market.
No fucking chance Sony’s going to let a rival set up shop on their own consoles. Not even a possibility. Look at how much Apple and Google fought with Epic over keeping them off their phones. And that’s just over a secondary app store on a device that can do a million different things that the parent companies can still find ways to monetize. You’re talking about a competitor selling a subscription to bypass PlayStation’s only source of sales. Sony will fight that with everything they’ve got and no cut of the subscription fees will ever be enough to change their minds.
Plus the Epic lawsuits set a precedent that if you provide zero support for third party stores (Apple) you’re fine, but provide second class support (Google) and you’re going to get fucked.
It's been tried multiple times and it just doesn't work. Physics (the speed of light) ultimately dictates latency. Streaming only works for a rather small subset of games that doesn't rely on reaction time or latency at all. And then only works for people who play those games a lot (you're not going to sub to a streaming game service if the majority of the games you want to play don't work on it). There's a reason Google Stadia died.
Looks like Microsoft is now entirely focusing on selling games rather than selling Xbox.
If that were true, they would have discontinued Xbox already. You are falling for their lie that they aren’t trying to lock people into a closed ecosystem.
The only reason anyone wants to sell consoles is to get you locked in that ecosystem and sell you games. They don't make a profit on the hardware, Xbox game pass is their headstart into purely game sales, well a subscription and cloud service that everyone is trying to jump on right now.
When they lock you into their hardware they get commission on third party game sales as well, or don’t have to pay other people commission on their first party game sales. Traditionally this is how console manufacturers made the bulk of their money but now Microsoft has game pass so they want to get it in front of as many people as possible I guess.
They’d love to have GamePass on Switch and PS5 already, Nintendo and Sony are the roadblock because they don’t want to lose the share of cash and hours of playtime on their own platforms.
Admittedly, that's helped by them doing terribly at selling hardware.
But also, screw gamepass and the subscription model overall. If we're gonna crap on Ubisoft for their recent foot-in-mouth episode let's be consistent and call all of it out. I'm cool with this as long as I can keep buying these in boxes.
But also, screw gamepass and the subscription model overall.
If GamePass meant “you just get everything”, I see a case for that but GamePass isn’t that. It’s “Here are a few Microsoft 1st party games scoring 7/10 other games cycle in and out like Netflix and you get no DLC so when you buy DLC and the game cycles out, you’re out of luck”
I'm not sure if you read my comment backwards or you're just agreeing with it?
Anyway, yeah, I think hte big problem gaming subs have is that unless you have first party ownership over every game in existence you can't do the Netflix thing of pretending to be selling the only expense you're ever gonna need. The way games work you engage with them too long and they cycle around too fast, so even if there is a big pool of games they offer it's just a big fat pit of FOMO and feeling bad for seeing that game you're mildly interested in come and go without actually having played it. I already have a stressful backlog without adding the pain point of monetizing my not getting around to all the games I'd like to play.
They’re horrible at making games too. Their biggest games have been IP conceived and developed externally and once they took them over they’ve run them into the ground of mediocrity. In over twenty years I don’t think any developer or franchise has benefited from Microsoft owning them.
I'm not sure who "they" is in this scenario. If it's Microsoft Games Studios... well, yeah, they're a publisher. You just described what a publisher is.
I think if we're talking about their recent publishing strategy they've certainly been on a bit of a rut. There's still some interesting stuff happening with their IP. They got Relic to make a surprsiingly faithful Age of Empires, people do like Microsoft Flight Sim, that type of thing. But still, yeah, they've made a lot of purchases and we haven't seen new games coming out from most of those to justify those purchases, which does speak to a bit of a struggle to find a direction. That Hellblade sequel looks intriguing, but for a publisher with a lot of fully owned studios that has been fighting claims of monopolistic practices for their high profile acquisitions their output from that stable hasn't picked up pace yet.
I get it, games take forever to make now. That Hellblade game has been marketed for as long as the Xbox Series has, and that came out in 2020. Still, that itself is a problem. If the big oil tanker is hard to steer you have to plan your turns before you get to the icebergs. I do genuinely hope they get it together, though. That's a lot of talent, IP and potential to let run on idle for too long. Or worse, to fail in the context of a major corporation and stop getting support.
They got Relic to make a surprsiingly faithful Age of Empires, people do like Microsoft Flight Sim, that type of thing.
“Their biggest games have been IP conceived and developed externally” so not really a counter argument to phillaholic when you mention two games outsourced to external developers.
Kinda. This is the exact opposite of that, in that they control the IP and went out to find an external dev with lots of subject matter expertise to make it.
On paper I'd say that's better than them buying Relic off of Sega, but then Sega fired a bunch of people at Relic this year, like everybody else, so what would have been better is very much up for debate.
I honestly don’t hate game pass, it’s great for trying games id never even consider buying and if I really like the game and it’s off of game pass I would purchase it. Or if you have a group of friends that like to hop between co-op games you can do that too.
Like the Yakuza game series they have all of them currently on game pass, but the new one won’t be and I’ll definitely be buying the game.
But if it gets to the point where Ubisoft goes and every studio starts making their own, I don’t think that will work if they don’t have the game catalogue to support it, that would mean Ubisoft could just start churning out horrible games to build their stupid catalogue.
It actually floors me that people don’t understand this. It’s the tried and tested subscription model business plan.
Create a compelling service > gain market share > crush competition > ramp up prices and introduce anti-consumer policies
And contrary to popular belief, GamePass isn’t making money. There’s a reason MS are very tight-lipped about saying whether it’s profitable or not, and why they hide GamePass within another segment in their financials.
Shit, look at the FTC leaks where Phil Spencer says nowhere near enough people have subscribed to GamePass to make it viable (no wonder they want it on more platforms!). Microsoft will up prices.
And people here will say “yeah but then I’ll cancel, I already have a large game library” - yeah, you do. But a kid in 10 years that has no games library, only GamePass? He won’t say “man, another GamePass price hike? I’m gonna cancel”, because his choice is between another, say, £18 per month (I just went with what I was paying for Netflix, idk what it’ll be), and having to drop several hundred/possibly over £1k just to get all the games he wants back. Games he will probably have to buy across 3+ different launchers.
Microsoft is in it for the long haul. Subscription Office software, GamePass, rumours of subscription options in Win12. MS doesn’t want your money now, they want money from you continuously and from any family you build (remember: if you have kids, they’ll use this stuff too, and you’ll be paying for it… until they’re an adult, then they’ll be hooked on it and probably pay for it thereafter).
You’ll be paying until the day you die and your children will pay from being 18 until they die.
Sure, it has its uses. So do the subscriptions from Ubisoft or EA, though.
All I'm saying is that the digital distribution outlets that people like and have a good reputation (Game Pass, Steam) still have all the downsides that people love to get mad about in the alternatives they dislike. That doesn't mean you should refuse to use the ones you like, but you should probably keep an eye on the effects it has on the art form and the industry.
I do see that since it’s Ubisoft, they could still push for games on the subscription service but in reality I could see the games being loaded up with micro transactions.
Or it could turn into a convoluted game demo service, where you can play a portion of a game then they hit you with a pay wall, and since you’ve already played X% of a game they could view it as more likely to buy.
OK, but that's not how reality works, you're making up offenses that nobody has committed because you've decided a particular brand is "bad" while ignoring actual offenses from brands you like and so have decided are "good".
So no, I'm gonna have to say your hypotheticals don't make their offerings any worse (or better) than Microsoft's or Valve's. Now, the pricing and lack of content? Yeah, we can talk about those. But those don't have anything to do with preservation concerns, lack of ownership or content churn, which are all legit issues with all digital distribution and subscriptions.
But if it gets to the point where Ubisoft goes and every studio starts making their own, I don’t think that will work if they don’t have the game catalogue to support it, that would mean Ubisoft could just start churning out horrible games to build their stupid catalogue.
I feel like we’re starting to see a rerun of the streaming service wars - if this takes off across the industry I can definitely see people going back to piracy. I don’t want game pass, ubisoft+, Blizzard Prime, Nintendo Online Super Premium Expansion Pass or whatever stupid names these companies come up with just to play a few games that I’m interested in, just because they’re spread across different publishers.
Would be massively surprised if this means anything else other than CoD which they got regulators worried about a little bit. they just want to reduce the eyeballs.
Maybe they’re learning from Sony. That barely anyone runs out to get another console for exclusives, way more people will wait or just not play the game. They’re mostly just leaving money on the table
I think they just finally learned XBOX isnt the big seller this generation, Playstation is the market leader for at least 2 generations because of their amazing first party games. Microsoft hasn’t had as good of a lineup for exclusive games, especially since they are already available on PC. See Halo Infinite and Starfield. There’s too many playstation users not to release games on that platform.
It feels like despite all that, Microsoft has had a lot more influence on the gaming industry the last 5 years than Sony because of their Game Pass push. Sony is fine doing what they’ve been doing, which is to put out like 3 great games a year.
Microsoft has struggled with great first-party games, but their services are far more interesting.
Nintendo has a category of its own. Which again also has a strong exclusives library. Switch users that own one of the more powerful consoles also go for playstation. 50 million PS5 vs 26 million XBOX Series consoles as of Nov 2023 vs 132 million Switches that has been out longer.
Nintendo actually try something new with their consoles too, so that's at least good.
Everyone should be moving to PC though, you actually have freedom there. I think Steam machines would do pretty good if they came out now.
Definitely won’t be all of them. Probably just a small set that are not huge money makers. They already publish some titles as third party, like Minecraft, Ori, and Lucky’s Tale.
Guessing we just get ports of, like, Hi-Fi Rush and Psychonauts, and continued support of some Activision titles that are 3rd party like Diablo 4, Spyro, Crash, and a token Call of Duty game.
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