When I started learning witchcraft, the majority taught that a spell should not be performed on someone without their consent, even benefic ones like healing or protection. I'm wondering how much/if this opinion has changed.
Would you do a spell (or pray) on someone without their consent?
@Cat_LeFey For me, it actually depends on the context.
Generally speaking, I try not to do spells or pray for other people without their consent. For one thing, doing it without always struck me as being rude, and for another, it might make the other party feel incredibly uncomfortable if they find out about it. For me, consent is a huge part of the process, and I want to respect the boundaries of the people involved.
Curses and hexes, though... no, I don't get permission from the person I'm cursing before I do it. It's not something I do very often, mind, but if I do it, it's usually because the guilty party did something to warrant it (and in my experience, they crossed boundaries the minute they did the thing worthy of being cursed for, anyway).
@quietcatatelier Yeah, it's probably best to think of it this way because magick doesn't happen in a vacuum, there's all kinds of counter-balancing going on.
I'm of the "hexes and curses are a-okay!" camp "threefold law, I don't know her!" so that's that out the way.
I also feel like... magic isn't stupid. And the root of all of my magical workings is intent. A spell that I might cast for someone with beneficial intent isn't gonna backfire in some kooky way.
I may ask the person, but for me that's actually part of the spell. Putting that energy out there so they know that someone is wishing them well.
@MsHearthWitch Yeah, the worst that's happened to me is that the spell will fizzle out and not work at all, I dont really believe in magick retribution or anything, too Christian for my tastes, lol.
But I do agree that any spell will work better if you do physical things to back it up, like letting them know about it, for good or ill. If someone is superstitious, sometimes just thinking they're cursed is good enough, ya know?
@Cat_LeFey Yeah, I think a lot of that retribution stuff comes out of how early Wicca was in many ways reskinned christianity with a pagan flare. If you get what I'm saying?
And absolutely I ascribe to the Granny Weatherwax School of Cursing. All the reward, none of the energy output, lol. Tell someone you've cursed them and the next time something bad happens they'll blame you!
@Cat_LeFey@MsHearthWitch This is such an interesting poll by the way, Cat, thank you. I feel like I have more thoughts, but stopped on this exchange and felt like responding.
I personally don't believe in "magickal retribution" but I do believe that plenty of practitioners don't know themselves as well as they think/get distracted/have subconscious or unconscious intentions that absolutely can interfere with magickal workings. This, to me, is the concern with spellcasting (or even praying? I guess? depending on the context? but I do feel as though that term needs to be defined here since we all seem to have different definitions for it) on behalf of someone else without OR even with their consent.
Quite frankly, also, projecting a significant amount of energy at anyone can lead to some weird effects for you, the person projecting that energy and for the person being projected at. We rarely recognize just how much psychic junk we're carrying around when it comes to other human beings.
@siin@MsHearthWitch Thank you for responding, I'm totally picking up what you're saying. We don't practice magick in lab conditions, the real world is a bag of entropy, so there's always gonna be interference of some kind.
I definitely think one of the hallmarks of moving from beginner to intermediate witchcraft is knowing when to do a spell, and when to let things be. Honestly most of the time, messing with things just makes them worse, probably because of what you're saying here, too much energetic baggage.
@Cat_LeFey@MsHearthWitch totally. I've found that it's actually really hard to tease out my true feelings (and the source of those feelings) about others. It's something I'm practicing very diligently through meditation and other mindfulness/healing modalities, but my guess is I'm not the only one who finds this tricky. At the same time, I never used to think my feelings were anything but straightforward - and this makes us energetic wrecking balls when we are so convinced we just "get it" and act accordingly. It's a learning process for us all!
I do totally get what you're saying. I guess I have, perhaps oddly given my age and years, a more simple view of magic.
Sure it doesn't happen in a vacuum. And feelings and emotions ARE complicated. But for me it always always comes back to intent. What is my intent? What is the purpose? That's what powers, drives and directs any spellwork. And my actions back that up.
I do agree tho, knowing when to leave it be is the crucial point.
As I've been pondering this I think it's because as a hearth witch my magic is... I guess what some would call the more basic kind. Peasant magic back in the day, vs court wizard stuff.
I don't really go in for the whole, magic with a K, elaborate workings thing. Nothing against it (although the person who popularized magic with a K was a racist POS so there is that). It's the homey, hearth, lifestyle sort of magic. Even the curses.
@MsHearthWitch@siin Yeah, I get this. Like instead of pouring energy into something to change it, it's more of a nudge, and in the direction it was likely going anyway. That's kinda what my hedge magic is to me, maintenance almost.
Yeah, very similar strains of thought between hedge and hearth magic I think. (labels are weird, lol).
But yes, it's more about going with the flow of things and giving a little push when needed, or attracting something. More than wrestling with the current.
@Sh4d0w_H34rt This is an old school Wicca thing, I don't even know if they still teach it that way anymore. There are so many different forms of paganism now, though, everyone kinda does their own thing.
@Cat_LeFey my favourite successful spell to date was when I conjured a better job for a department head, but with responsibility over me (no consent, just pure rage)
@Cat_LeFey I feel like consent is very important, in most cases.
If it's just praying for someone, lighting a candle, stuff like that; I feel like that's okay.
But spells can sometime backfire; I wouldn't want someone to be hindered by a spell that didn't work properly or went wrong. If they gave consent or asked for the spell then it's okay because they know the ''risks''.
Also I've read that spells will work way better when the target consents & gives an offering you can use in your spell.
@karlpybara This makes sense, though I haven't had any of my spells fail in a catastrophic way, any meddling can cause ripples, so it's understandable. I think it was Doreen Valiente who wrote about how spells might not work without consent, and many of us wouldn't be witches today without her efforts to make it publically acceptable, so there's wisdom in taking the high road regardless.
@Cat_LeFey I would seek a restraining order on someone without their consent if I had to; I can't see holding back on spellwork, if I felt the need and understood the ramifications.
@senanthic That's a good point, sums up my feelings too. I'm definitely in the 'curses are OK' camp, but I'm not gonna waste energy unless it's something important.
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