This magazine is from a federated server and may be incomplete. Browse more on the original instance.

UziBobuzi, in What's the age cut off for socially acceptable gaming
UziBobuzi avatar

I'll be 59 this year and have been gaming since Pong. They'll pry my controller from my cold, dead fingers. Also, I'm a woman as is the circle I play with, who are also all older women (45+). We do exist and couldn't give a fuck about what society thinks about it.

Better gaming than just being a potato watching TV every spare minute with no other outlet.

Gaming's been shown to help prevent dementia because it keeps the brain active.

Consider that the women that you've been trying to date that don't appreciate gaming just aren't the right partner for you.


I appreciate that, thank you! My ex could never work out why I preferred playing video games to a more mature activity like watching TV which always seemed like it was the wrong way round to me - at least I get to interact with my entertainment 😂

Asenath avatar

50 year old female, been playing video games since the Atari 2600. With the SO since 1996.

Methinks OP just needs to meet more women. There is no "cut off age at which video games are no longer an acceptable pastime".


I think I need to meet more women as well 😂 but that's a different thread!

Ragnell avatar

Gaming vs dementia isn't new. I started gaming on my greatgrandmother's atari system in the 80s, which was doctor recommended for her Alzheimers.

Hawne avatar

58 with a similar background (except that I'm a man) and I have no intention to stop.

I'm essentially a PC gamer but had a few game consoles too (until Dreamcast), which I ditched as soon as PCs were able to provide a decent platform for modern gaming. I'm a modder and occasionally a tweaker so I prefer having total control over my gaming environment than being restricted by a closed system console.

I love many game genres, my favorites being immersive open worlds and strategic action and stealth games (à la Ghost Recon Wildlands or Mass Effect) but I don't limit myself to those. Each genre brings its own amusement and interest, either honing your reflexes or challenging your cooperation skills or your memory.

And above all, gaming is fun!

There is no age cut off for enjoying challenging both your mind and reflexes, nor to have fun. And imho enjoying gaming at our ages is one of the many symptoms of still being a young soul.

gk99, in Minecraft's devs exit its 7 million-strong subreddit after Reddit's ham-fisted crackdown on protest

I feel as if this is the first real sign that this shit has had an impact. Minecraft isn't a small community by any means, and them ditching the huge subreddit over this is shocking.

HuddaBudda avatar

It makes sense from a perspective that their jobs just got a lot harder, they don't have any of the tools they used to, they are being threaten with termination if they don't volunteer their free time.

Why would anyone want to do that hobby?

Jinxyface, in I’ve fallen into a deep gaming rut lately. What helped “get you back into” gaming and rediscover the magic of video games?

If you’re burnt out on games, more games won’t solve that and will just make it worse

Go explore some other hobbies for a bit

jclinares avatar

Excellent response, and pretty much what I was going to say. I have a few hobbies (games, movies, camping, reading, live music) that I don't always have time for, at the same time. So sometimes I'll spend my free time hiking and camping, other times I'll watch movies in the evenings when I get home, and other times I'll play games.

Even something you enjoy can get tiring, if you do it a lot; and there's nothing wrong with putting that aside for a time, to spend time doing other things you like.


Hobbies like boobmodding skyrim.

frevaljee avatar

Modding skyrim is usually 99 % setting up the mods and 1 % gaming anyways, if I'm being generous.


And put health first. I know a good chunk of the time I spend browsing my Steam library and thinking "a thousand channels and nothing's on," is me being exhausted in disguise.

The best thing to do when gaming loses its magic is far and away to just stop gaming and find new ways to rest and wind down.


Gasph How dare you tell someone to touch grass?

garretble avatar

I like to tell people I have three pillars of media - books, tv/movies, games. I’m always consuming all three, but when I feel a bit burned out on one type, I just ignore it for a bit.


Yep same, I have a list I keep of books/movies/tv/games I'm interested in. If I start watching a show and binge it for a bit, I'll take a break and read a few chapters of a book, then maybe play a game.

Variety is the spice of life, as they say

Teali0 avatar

This is a great point. Pursue other interests for the time being; don't necessarily stop gaming altogether though. I had a few gaming ruts in my life and around the same time I was in grad school.

Something a professor had said to the class about writing a thesis paper can apply to many things in life: "When you find yourself enjoying what you are doing, stop for the day while you are still enjoying it because you'll be excited to get back to it next time. If you stop working on something when you're forcing yourself to do it, you'll have a much harder time being motivated to continue."

It's not very profound, but I related it to the gaming rut I was in at the time but it helped me bounce back.

smart_boy, in I HATE “boomer shooter”

Rookie Level 1 Gamer: "They're called boomer shooters because they're old like baby boomers" Veteran Level 20 Gamer: "Baby boomers thought Doom was satanic, that's a stupid term" Enlightened Level 60 Gamer: "They're called boomer shooters because of the huge debt they owe to the original Doom modding scene and therefore "Boom", one of the first limit-removing source ports"


I’m STEALING this and pretending I wrote it. You are a jeeneus and get all the interwebz points for the day!

Nihilore avatar

who writes like this?


The guy he copied this other comment from

Ragnell avatar

You have redeemed the term.

JDPoZ avatar Level 80 gamer... :
"Who cares. My ego isn't so delicate as to have my sensibilities offended by whatever the fuck you want to call it. If you think something like 'MyHouse.wad' is something that is for "bOoMeRs" (a.k.a. anyone old enough to know that it's called a "VCR," not a "VHS player") then you're the one missing out... not me."


Galaxy brain: "hehe boomstick go boom"


NGL, when I first saw the term, I assumed it was a reference to "boom sticks".

OonTaaKissa, in Is it me or are games really not fun anymore
OonTaaKissa avatar

What types of games are you playing? Sounds like you are describing a generic AAA "live service" game, there are plenty of fun games but you have to search for them in a sea of soulless corporate cashgrabs. I would recommend trying games by smaller developers. If you want to play with friends I would recommend indie co-op games like risk of rain 2 or deep rock galactic. Or maybe you are just burnt out on gaming? Never hurts to take a break, try another hobby for a bit and come back reinvigorated

CoderKat avatar

Live service games, MMOs, gatcha games, and many hardcore multiplayer games are the worst for this. They love to waste player's time on some repetitive grind because they want players to keep playing their game. They usually have either microtransactions (often for cosmetics) or a subscription.

Personally, I love MMOs, but I try to avoid playing any grindy content (or at least as long as I don't think I'll genuinely enjoy it). So I'll usually play a game for a few months (they're really big games) and then quit for years, if not permanently (I have a bunch of MMOs I intend to someday return to, but have not yet).

Single player games are generally much better at being genuinely fun. Especially story driven games. I also love open world games because you largely get to make them your own. It's perfectly valid to beeline the story missions if that's all you care about. Or you could do just the side quests. Or you could additionally explore like crazy. e.g., with Tears of the Kingdom, you really can ignore most of the shrines and largely focus on the story quests. None of the side quests are necessary, either. You don't have to explore the depths except for a tiny few places for the story. The vast majority of sky islands can be ignored. But I personally had a lot of fun exploring, so I explored nearly everything and loved it (except most of the depths -- they were way too big, empty, and repetitive).

Some people don't like long games, though. And that's fine! There's tons of short or more streamlined games out there that you can have fun with. e.g., The Last of Us is a fantastic one. The sequel is about 24 hours long for the story and it felt like it flew by in the blink of an eye for me cause I was having so much fun.


Was going to say this as well. As a long time destiny player it very much feels like checking boxes or doing chores each week.

I've finally managed to break away and play other games and am so excited for my current to do pile. Mass Effect 1,2,3 done, Andromeda is in progress and after that is Control, Cyberpunk and Fallout 4.

navi, in Rant: Valve's new Steam Deck screws speak volumes about their ethos. avatar

Less of a rant, more of a rave.

Cool upgrade for hobbiests.

Redhotkurt avatar

Ya from the title I expected OP to be complaining because they don’t own a torx head screwdriver/bit.


Was expecting the same and I didn't even know they switched to torx. Philips screws are bad. I go out of my way and spend extra money to avoid them.


Whoops. Unintentional clickbait.

Exec, avatar

Me, as one who only read the first line before scrolling to the comments, good thing that others pointed out about the topic itself


Are rants inherently negative?


rant /rănt/ intransitive verb

  1. To speak or write in an angry or emotionally charged manner; rave.
  2. To express at length a complaint or negative opinion.

My b


Nah, definition 1 right there isn’t inherently negative. It’s certainly more involved than otherwise necessary and seems somewhat driven by emotion, so while it skips the negative connotation I think this counts plenty well.


I think of a rant more as a long-winded statement that most people would agree with. Sort of a “off my chest” kinda thing.


By definition, no, but most people probably assume negativity when they hear the word rant.

TwilightVulpine, in Denuvo wants to convince you its DRM isn’t “evil”

COO says coming benchmarks will show anti-piracy tech has no performance impact.

They do decryption and network calls during runtime. Computers are not magic, you cannot do additional processing, call on external resources and not have a performance impact. I will never trust when they say this, not once ever. They have a vested interest in convincing people of this even if it's simply not possible.

SenorBolsa, (edited ) avatar

on a modern PC doing that is almost entirely trivial if implemented correctly, I hate DRM but to be honest they may be right that it has no appreciable effect on the final performance of the product for the vast majority of users. Of course that’s dependent on proper implementation, what are the odds these folks at Denuvo can do that? pretty low.

Activation limits and compatibility are the biggest issues for me.

LoafyLemon avatar

Resident Evil Village was a good example of that. People tested the two versions, and the cracked one was significantly faster on all runs. Even media reported on it.


They even ended up removing denuvo from resident evil because of the performance issues…


Capcom did not remove Denuvo due performance impacts. They released an update without it because the big bucks from selling the game happen early in the games lifespan, not year or two later.

Denuvo is a license model, so the longer game contains it, the longer the company needs to pay for the license.

It’s merely a cost savings removal, as happens with many games that contain Denuvo.


Well… modern computers have crypto accelerating instructions, and games rarely use all the cores to their full potential, offloading as much as they can to the GPU instead, while network traffic is relatively minimal, so it is possible to run a lot of stuff on the same computer without impacting the performance of the game itself.

That doesn’t fix the rest of the problems, though.


Sure if the person's PC is well beyond what is required they won't notice it, but I've played on old and underpowered PCs with bad internet connections enough not to assume that there will be always plentiful resources to spare.


Fair point, but does Denuvo apply to games that run on underpowered PCs? I might be mistaken, but I thought Denuvo was only meant for the “AAA” titles that require top tier hardware anyway.


What i you’re right at or below the “minimum requirements” for an AAA game? Should those people just not get to play?


Then you’d get a degraded experience anyway, I don’t think the difference would be noticeable. Where it would be noticeable, would be with retro games on pretty old hardware.

Either way, even if it were to slow a game by 50%, that would still not be the biggest issue with Denuvo.


One percent from ~ 45avg fps, especially the low drops, feel worse when there’s even more intermittent losses from DRM.

It’s harder to notice a few fps drop at 100+.

Pixelologist, (edited ) in Steam Summer Sale: Hidden Gem/ Recommendations thread

I feel obligated to recommend a Steam Deck if you have interest in one and can afford it.

We have 2 and I would get a 3rd if I could lol (with a bulky protective case etc. so I can be less careful)

The most cost efficient way to go is buy the cheapest version and then put something like this in it


If you don't want to do that you can alternatively just get a big micro SD card and save the SSD swap for laterFor best speeds you want it to say A2 and have a 3 inside a U.

Even besides playing video games it's an awesome little mini pc. Not perfect but awesome, and an amazing value at $359.


Is there a most cost effective choice for ssd that’s “known” (or was that the one you linked)

Or is it just get the cheapest 2230 you can find


I did a lot of searching myself like 2 weeks ago because I had to swap out both mine and my partner's and AFAIK, the standard 1TB price for trustworthy 2230's are about 100 bucks unfortunately. If you still want a recommendation, this is what I bought

Catch42 avatar

You can swap the ssd! Why are they charging so much to upgrade to only 256gb of Nvme storage?


Probably because they're losing money on the cheapest one


Because you still need to take the device apart to replace the drive. They’ve always been transparent about the fact that the SSD is easy to swap, but there are options available for people who want more storage who don’t want to or don’t feel comfortable about taking it apart.


Wait does the 64GB option support M.2 NVMe? I thought it only supports eMMC and that you can't swap with a different NVMe drive, but maybe I'm wrong?


as someone with a 64gb deck with a 512gb drive swapped in I can confirm it works!


That's a good question but no, it will work.


The 64GB emmc drive in the Deck uses the m.2 expansion slot, so you can pop out the emmc drive and swap in a 2230 form factor nvme drive and be gtg after reinstalling SteamOS.

I myself went from a 256GB drive to a 1TB drive, and this weekend, I'll be popping in a 2TB drive I just received in the mail.


It would cost more to lock out the capability than not.

Everything but the storage drive, the screen, and the case is identical between the three units.

Hellebert, (edited )

Yo Valve can you please sell them where I live already so that I don't have to pay some shitty eBay scalper or overpriced reshipper?


Do you know how much it would cost to cost to ship from the US?


Looking at Shipitto it's about $65 for the cheapest option currently.

Last time I checked they were all over $100.

Xathonn avatar

I had heard that swapping the ssd yourself voids warranty, is that true? Or is it only if you swap more stuff

Pixelologist, (edited )

No that is not true. Also even if you drop it they have a repair center you can ship to that charges fair prices. They have a very positive reputation about this kind of thing (also RMAs, which I went through personally)


In the US, that's illegal (Magnuson Moss warranty act). In a lot of the rest of the first world, there are similar laws. But regardless, Valve hasn't shown any of the patterns some do of ignoring the law and forcing you to jump through hoops to exercise your rights, and there were a decent number of stories on Reddit of them fixing clear customer damage under warranty.


You could also buy the 64g and get a sd card that what i did no slowing with any game and enough space for 4-5 big game or a lot of small one but i never have more than 2-3 games installed anyway otherwise i just game jump and never finish any l


To add context for people viewing, putting games on a fast micro sd card (A2, 3 in a U) has negligible performance losses compared to putting the game on an internal drive. I was skeptical at first, but other than slightly longer times loading SD cards work beautifully for steamdeck games


thanks for adding context ! For added bonus you can use multiple micro sd so you don't have to download and install games each time just swap the card and ready to go.

Thebazilly, in Diablo 4 is down due to a DDoS attack


Reminder that Blizzard sexually harassed an employee literally to death.


Not to mention the kowtowing to China and the countless other controversies. Same thing with Riot Games with their sexual harassment settlement and 100% being owned by Tencent (a company that operates a mass-surveillance network against ethnic minorities). So funny how everyone forgets about these things when a company releases a product they like.

AlteredStateBlob avatar

And then WoW still got kicked out of China. GG Blizzard, GG. God damn Bobby Kotick is a horrible, horrible person. Thinking about dating Bobby Kotick? Don't.

alejandro avatar

Thinking about dating Bobby Kotick? Don't.

Lol that comment is weird as hell without any context. Here's the context for anybody that hasn't seen it.

Virkkunen avatar

It's not that they "forget about it" they just don't care. People want to enjoy things.

If you were to stay on the high horse and stop consuming products and services made by companies with track records like Actiblizzard, you'd probably end living off the grid in a cave


This should be the top comment in anything related to Activision-Blizzard so that people don’t forget. And Bobby Kotick is STILL CEO.


My Blizzy Boycott continues until Bobby is out. I sometimes think about Starcraft but I have held strong so far.

Virkkunen avatar

Okay Mr Redditor, but I just want to enjoy this game with my friends on the weekend before coming back to work on Monday


You can play another game

interolivary, avatar

No, they have to play the one made by a company known for its toxic work culture.

Not that that isn't like 80% of the industry, though…

BettyWhiteInHD avatar

Gamers are so goofy, I swear to god.

We arguably live in a golden age of gaming, there are so many goddamn games to play and people still swarm to the one made by companies that fucking killed people and are actively working to milk as much money out of you as possible and to make the hobby you enjoy worse in the long run in favor for short term profits. This is why people don't take you people seriously.


This is capitalism at its finest. I do not have time to care about the people who made this. I do not want to care about them. I am too overworked to have time to find another hobby. I just want to escape by any means necessary with others before I must return to the grind. I understand this feeling completely and don't fault you.

AnonymousLlama avatar

People are generally pretty keen on being on their high horses when it comes to philosophical questions about which company is "good" and how no one should play their games ever because of previous mis-steps

It's pretty unrealistic to expect the vast majority of people who just want to play games with their friends to not play them because of ideological reasons.

Sucks to not be about to play with your mates

ampersandrew avatar

You don't have to expect the vast majority of people to see things your way, but you can explain to your friends that it's important to not support Blizzard due to X, Y, or Z, and then you can play Grim Dawn or something instead.

nekusoul, (edited ) in Please help me select parts for a "competent" gaming PC avatar

Simply going one step down from buying every “halo” product would already do wonders for a significant price/performance increase.

That said, when building a new PC I usually start with the recommendations listed at Logical Increments, which has a neat table sorted by budget. Anything at or above the “Suberb” should give you what you want at 1440p.

I’d also very much recommend a high refresh rate monitor, preferably 1440p, which has either GSYNC or FreeSync with a good variable refresh rate range. It really helps with maintaining a smooth presentation as you aren’t forced to keep your game running at a fixed framerate anymore.


Thank you for the link; will take a look at that as well.

Chozo, in Elon Musk demanded a cameo in Cyberpunk 2077 while wielding a 200 year old gun: "I was armed but not dangerous"
Chozo avatar

Elon is literally everything Cyberpunk warns is about. He's the biggest corpocunt the world has ever seen. Arasaka is exactly what Elon wants X Corp to be. He's actually trying to make chips that get implanted into your brain. He wants his own Relic. He wants to be the immortal Saburo Arasaka.

The lack of self awareness is astounding.

Skyline969, avatar

If Keanu was in the studio that day, someone should have said “Silverhand, arm the nuke.”


Can’t be a billionaire if you pass a certain threshold of self-awareness, it’s the rules.

doom_and_gloom, (edited ) avatar


  • Loading...
  • tias,

    I’m in the camp that is just trying to acclimatize and mentally prepare.

    IvyRaven, in Phil Spencer: "getting [acquiring] Nintendo would be a career moment for me"; Nintendo's future "exists off of their own hardware" avatar

    Micrsoft’s gaming head honchos were talking about making a monopoly. And it’s clearly the goal. They don’t care about gamers or games just hurting Sony (they said their main goal was to kill Playstation). The ActiBlizz acquire showed them they can buy anyone. Monopolies of any kind are bad, and this would be horrible.


    They don’t care about gamers or games

    There is no such thing as a company that cares about the product they make or the people who buy their product. The purpose of every company is solely to make money. The product itself is, to some degree, arbitrary. The only reason Microsoft even makes video games is because it’s adjacent, and in some ways a natural extension of, their original business.


    This is especially true of publicly traded companies.

    A publicly traded company's customers are it's investors, and it's product is shareholder value. Everything else they do is just the manufacturing process.


    This is too broad of a brushstroke. Is there any megacorporation that cares about its customers? Doubt it. But are plenty of small studios that clearly value the quality of their product.

    TwilightVulpine, (edited )

    Nintendo does care about making good games, or it wouldn't make all the weird moves that it does, and it wouldn't consistently output quality titles like it does. We are just so used to dispassionate money leeches controlling everything that the idea that anyone in charge cares about anything but money seems hard to believe.

    Which is all the more reason why Microsoft can't be allowed to acquire it.

    IvyRaven, avatar

    Yes I know. But I wanted to make a general statement instead of typing out all the realities of corporations in our end stage capitalist hellscape. Typing on my phone is hard lol

    lonewalk, in Unity introducing new fee attached to game installs

    Godspeed Godot, fuck every single tech company enshittifying the whole sector to hell.


    Godot's only issue is the lack of console support, but that's because they can't get the licenses as an open source project.


    They support dual licensing for this very reason.


    How does that help if there’s no engine support?


    It essentially allows for special closed source builds. These closed source builds can have the engine support for consoles and still be in keeping with Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo's licenses.


    I didn't know that. How do the developers get access to these builds? Are they sold? Or do they need to build it themselves?


    So, basically the console manufacturer gives you the SDK, integration code, etc after you sign their NDAs. After that, you can either use what they gave you to port it yourself to that console, or you can pay someone else for their build.


    This, right here.

    Hey EU. How about lowering that barrier to entry by pumping a couple of million Euro’s into cold-room reverse engineering the API’s and developing an open source alternative that can be distributed freely.

    We’ll invite Sony lawyers, Microsoft lawyers, watch them cope and seethe as their framework is made more open…

    …aaaand then realising that a lot more people will take the shot to pay for actual licensing. Go figure.


    You’re still going to need them to sign your binary for the console to recognize it as legit.

    Circumventing the official path worked back in the 80s and 90s, but modern consoles and their SDKs were designed with those lessons in mind.

    520, (edited )

    It's still valuable information for those that would seek to load homebrew (unsigned code) onto their systems.

    Console security is one of those things where every additional barrier helps. The goal isn't to outright prevent homebrew or piracy but to limit the scope of breaches and delay them as much as possible. Even modern consoles like the Switch and PS5 are not immune


    It would be great if there was a guaranteed way to homebrew your consoles, but yeah security and stability is the real thing we benefit from. I don’t think anyone would advocate for more hackers in console multiplayer games, and I don’t want a homebrew game I’m running to crash or brick my system because of their fly-by-night hardware usage.

    520, (edited )

    So, I didn't bring up Xbox earlier, because Microsoft has an official way to run homebrew on Xbox consoles.

    All modern Xboxes have access to something called developer mode. This allows people to put whatever code they like on it, but removes the ability to play retail games. The change isn't permanent, however, and switching between the modes is perfectly safe.

    This is a big part of the reason why Xbox 1 never had piracy; pirates couldn't piggyback on the back of homebrewers, who simply opted to use developer mode instead of cracking the console.


    Interesting, I didn’t realize this. I assumed a dev kit was always required for that behavior, and that’s why Nintendo offering a cheap switch dev kit was such a big deal. TIL


    The Godot developers created a new business entity that will facilitate porting games to closed platforms.

    atocci avatar

    I was going to say, I know Cassette Beasts released on Switch and it uses the Godot engine, so there's no way it doesn't support consoles.


    Also, Sonic Colors on Switch used Godot code in violation of the license, whoops.

    insomniac_lemon avatar

    I am not sure this is something other engines even offered at this level, but my issue is bindings support.

    3.X had (3rd-party) production-ready bindings, even for niche languages.

    4.X, with hopes of improving support for compiled languages, has a new bindings system meaning that all bindings need to be redone as a new effort. This happened with the language that I'm interested in, the group that made the production-ready 3.X bindings abdicated the crown and there have been splintered efforts by individuals to work on 4.X bindings.

    So it (3.X vs 4.X) is language vs engine features. When/if 4.X bindings do come out, it is not known how similar they will be so (aside from non-Godot-specific code) that will likely add complication to it as well.

    I don't really care about consoles (needing to jump through hoops to develop for it is one reason) so a different potential issue would web export limitations. Both for different languages and for visual quality (AA). Those were issues in the past, though I'm not actually sure where they're at now (the 4.1 docs do say you can't have C# web exports in 4.X).

    Dark_Arc, avatar

    I’m all for Godot getting better; that said, has Epic, Open3D, or Crytek made similar moves?

    (I know Crytek isn’t much of a player currently, but as someone who’s been following them closer in recent years, it really seems like they got their house back in order)


    I think epic made their engine more appealing by waiving some Epic Games Store charges for Unreal games. And had a no fee until 1m earnings thing. Not this kind of shit.

    MJBrune, (edited ) in I Simply Do Not Have Room On My PC For Starfield

    1 TB SSDs are 35-60 dollars.
    1 TB HDDs are 22-50 dollars.
    2 TB HDDs are 40-65 dollars.
    2 TB SDDs are 60-90 dollars.

    Clearly, price shouldn’t be an issue because one of these drives that give you 10 times the storage is the cost of 1 new release, and the theoretical person who just bought BG3 and Starfield just spent 120 dollars minimum. So theoretical person let’s do some math!

    Seems really silly to complain that you ran out of space on your PC. Get another drive. If you’ve filled up your SATA ports, get a PCIe SATA card. If you have all your onboard SATA slots full, plus your PCIe slots are full, plus you’ve upgraded all the drives you could to at least 1 TB, that typically gives you at least 2-4 TB total. BG3 is taking up 150 GB that you reserved for gaming. Uninstall it if you want to play Starfield. If you don’t want to play Starfield that badly then you have your answer.

    Clearly, the real answer is that this person needs another drive in their computer. They act like the OS drive is the only thing that could possibly exist in a computer. Worst case, go get a USB 3 drive and toss Starfield on that.

    stopthatgirl7 avatar

    It’s a touch trickier to upgrade a laptop, which the writer is talking about.


    No it’s not, unless they have a MacBook. And even in that case it’s not hard to find an external SSD with a thunderbolt or USB3.2 interface.


    There are plenty of PC laptops with drives that aren’t easy to upgrade, it ain’t just MacBooks anymore.


    New MacBooks have their memory soldered directly to the main board and don’t have an extra m.2 port. There are very few windows laptops that meet both of those criteria. But like I said, even in those cases you can install games on an external drive.


    Most laptops come with an empty SATA or NVME drive.


    I’d be inclined to agree but I’m frankly somewhat at a loss from this articles perspective. Why a 256gb boot drive in 2023? I’m only assuming, based on the math. If it were 512GB I’d assume they’d be able to shuffle off more data. If it’s important files you need to access, store them on an external HDD? If they’re a gamer and they know space is an issue, a SSD enclosure is not much more added cost to a 1TB drive and it solves the issue…

    Like I said, I understand the intent about game sizes. But people playing BG3 or Starfield on their laptop are going to have other issues on top of storage, since most laptops have a pretty linear upgrade path. If you have the 256gb model the rest of the hardware probably reflects that pricepoint. Like @bandario said, at a certain point the idea of a game coming preloaded on a USB drive makes sense, but until then the ease for general use of an SSD enclosure makes more sense.


    Yeah, 256gb doesn’t really get you very far these days. Everything is so bloated, including the operating system.


    Is it that hard in the days of solid state NVME drives? You just pop open the hatch and pop them in the slot.


    Assuming you have a spare slot (and your laptop is designed in a way to make that swap easy)


    They are a game reviewer, it’s kinda embarrassing that they don’t hve a decent setup to playtest the games they review.

    Caligvla, avatar

    I legitimately hope you’re trolling.

    rovingnothing29 avatar

    I swear I've seen this post verbaitm elsewhere.

    EarlTurlet, avatar

    What the heck did you just say about storage, you little newbie? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in Computer Engineering, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on terrible cable management, and I have over 300 confirmed SSD installs. You’re complaining about space on your PC like it’s some sort of divine mystery? Listen up, sailor.

    You’re whining about dropping $120 on BG3 and Starfield? You could get a 1TB SSD for as low as 35 bucks, you scallywag. Don’t even get me started on HDDs; a 1TB one is practically a steal at 22 dollars. And let’s go big or go home: 2TB HDD for 40-65 dollars, or if you’re feeling ritzy, a 2TB SSD at 60-90. Still less than your precious games, maggot.

    You’re out of SATA ports? Son, have you heard of a PCIe SATA card? Load that baby up. You’ve got more slots on your motherboard than you have excuses. Talking about running out of space with a setup that should give you 2-4TB at least? Don’t make me laugh. You’re telling me you can’t find space for your precious BG3? That’s only 150GB, sailor, uninstall it if you’re so keen on playing Starfield.

    And if you’ve hit the limits of both onboard SATA and PCIe, then I have one word for you: USB 3. Worst case, you get an external drive and run Starfield from there. Don’t act like your OS drive is the final frontier; there are many ways to expand your digital seas, you landlubber.

    So before you cry about storage again, maybe do some basic math and stop acting like you’re navigating uncharted waters. Get another drive, or walk the plank.


    The sentiment isn't wrong. Space is cheap now. Had Star field come out when SSDs were having GPU-like pricing I'd be more outraged, but prices are falling and having multi-terabyte systems shouldn't be an issue. Way cheaper than GPUs that can play the game, that's for sure.

    ampersandrew avatar

    Nah, you can find people complaining about games being too big in cycles going all the way back to the beginning of retail PC gaming. I remember Screen Savers built their "Ultimate Gaming PC" in like 1998 with a few gigabytes of storage, and they said something like, "I know that seems like a lot, but games these days can be hundreds of megabytes, so we want to be able to just fit them all". Baldur's Gate 3 and Starfield are both large games. Not every game is that big, nor are these games necessarily doing something wrong by being that big.

    SSD prices finally started dropping rapidly, and HDDs are even cheaper, for games like Sea of Stars or 30XX that don't need read speed performance, both of which have options to extend laptop storage space like the author's use case.

    Bizarroland avatar

    I don't know, I remember being a kid and hearing my mom complaining about some game needing like five floppy disks to install.

    My childhood computer had 80 MB of storage on it and 15 of that was used up by the operating system, so I guess installing a 9 MB game was actually pretty taxing.

    SenorBolsa, avatar

    A 10MB game is basically the equivalent of a 100GB one now.


    Remember Strike Commander? The floppy disk version (with very limited speech as well) wanted some 40-50MB when the common HDD sizes were 80-120 MB. I had a larger-than-average 240MB and it'd still have hurt if I didn't have a CD-ROM drive to play the CD edition instead.


    Remember Baldur’s Gate 2, which had multiple installation options for different amounts of the game running from the HDD vs CD, and it felt so extravagant to go “install all of it on the HDD!”


    I had to uninstall all other games to play baldurs gate back in the days. Running the game without ever needing to switch CDs. Was worth it.


    Nah, I loved changing out those disks. Core memory nostalgia material right there. Waste of time for sure, but one I remember fondly in hindsight.


    Look at moneybags over here throwing around cash instead of just making space


    I mean my biggest recommendation is that you can only really play one game at a time, maybe just download the game you want to play later, later.


    I’ve got a better idea. You want to make your game stupidly large? Ok fine, sell me a physical copy pre-installed on a fast USB stick. Job done.


    That would work only in the console (or Apple) world where you can control who and how can access the data. Otherwise someone will stick it to an USB 1.1 hub connected to the USB 2.0 port for the mouse and then complain “the game is unbearably slow!!!”

    Plus I don’t think anyone would want to pay $150 for a game (no, you can’t use a $10 USB drive for this)


    Given that Starfield has a requirement for an SSD even in minimum requirements, would even USB3 be fast enough?

    Still, avatar

    just need the USB 3.2 2x2 gen 2 thing (thanks USB for that fucked up name scheme) that the USB spec mangled for the 40 Gbps transfer speed


    You also have to be careful with what other USB devices you plug into your computer (both internal and external). The spec is 40 Gb/s for the controller, but ports often share the same controller and the bandwidth will be split between connected devices. For some computers, this could mean that 3 or more ports should be completely blocked off when plugging your gaming USB drive in, at least while playing the game. If your PC only has a single USB controller, I guess you’ll also need bluetooth peripherals.


    Fair enough, I imagine the potential audience of people who both have that tech (and are aware of if rather than it just coming with their machine) and also don’t have enough internal memory to install a game is quite small in the grand scheme of things and a hard sell for a publisher.


    Should be.


    I’ll let ya know.

    ampersandrew avatar

    You can get a USB 3 SD card reader and a fast SD card yourself. Even if it was bundled with the game, you're paying for the cost of the physical materials.

    Deceptichum avatar

    Damn I’m paying $3 more for production costs in a large scale bulk order.

    Too much! Better give me a shitty plastic trinket and a postcard.


    I don’t think you understand economies of scale. It doesn’t make sense for me to pay retail price for a single unit, especially if I have no other use for it. These costs are trivial at scale, and would also hopefully provide some impetus to optimise the code and texture storage.

    ampersandrew avatar

    Economies of scale aren't magic. Games are somewhat resistant to price increases in the face of inflation because we've shifted to digital distribution that you're looking to erode with the suggestion of shipping with physical media again, and you'd still have to pay well more than half of the price it would take you to buy that same media on Amazon. The storage size has grown because they've been optimizing for other factors, and I'm sure they came to the conclusion that it's more likely you'll free up space or buy storage expansions in the future after a price drop than it is that you would buy a game that ran worse or looked worse forever because they optimized more for storage space.


    I am happy to pay whatever extra it costs to have the experience of actually owning a game on a lasting medium with some artwork. My experience with digital downloads is that I just never care as much. Often I won’t even finish the game unless it is beyond amazing. I like to receive tangible things for my hard earned money I guess.

    dreadgoat avatar

    Flash drives are not a lasting medium. You'd need something like a quad-layer blu-ray, which is not cheap and has slow read speeds compared to solid state storage. Also nobody has blu-ray readers anymore. Also blu-ray publishers are tiny. Also the expense of distributing physical media.

    So we've arrived back at the beginning - you can have this cake and eat it too, but you're going to have to eat the expense yourself. Imposing it upon the entire consumer market is selfish and wasteful.


    Read speeds from a USB stick are incomparably slower than most hard drives. The USB 3.0 specification has a theoretical maximum transfer rate of 5Gb/sec (~600MB/s). By comparison, my PCIe 4.0 NVMe (I believe most laptops these days come with NVMe storage? Could be wrong) has a read performance, reported by CrystalDiskMark, of 7.3GB/s (that’s a big B, not a little b, and looking at 1MiB sequential 1 thread 8 queues). In other words, my hard drive’s measured performance is 12x faster than the theoretical maximum throughput of a USB drive. This also doesn’t take into account things like DirectStorage, which some games have started to adopt.

    I think realistically games should consider separating the higher quality assets from the low quality assets intended for lower performance systems, and make them separate downloads. HD assets could be a free “DLC” on Steam, for example.


    I hear what you’re saying, but I have about 200 games stored on a traditional HDD that only provides me a read speed of about 220MB/s absolute maximum and I have never had a single issue with any game running from it. As you say this could become a problem as devs adopt directstorage but as it stands right now, it’s a total none-issue.

    I have a 2TB NVME M.2 drive in my PC but don’t really see any advantage to putting games on there, that’s what bulk storage is for. If you are playing online, 99% of games will have a countdown or otherwise make you wait until the slowest PC is also ready to go. If it’s a game that uses loading screens, I really don’t care as it still loads pretty damn fast.

    Pretty much the only games that I will throw on my M.2 drive is open world games that load as you go if I am on my first playthrough. RDR2 lived on there for a while.

    Scary_le_Poo, avatar
    • Buy 2tb NVME for 60 bucks
    • Buy NVME usb 3 gen 2 enclosure for 20 bucks
    • Get drive speeds comparable to an internal ssd
    • Profit???
    TehPers, (edited )

    USB 3.2 gen 2x2’s theoretical speeds cap out at 20Gb/s (or 2.5GB/sec). It’s certainly a performance improvement compared to USB 3.0, but still doesn’t quite meet the performance of an internal NVMe. If your PC supports Thunderbolt, you get double the bandwidth (so 5GB/sec) which does match what some slower PCIe 4.0 NVMe drives can handle. This is of course assuming you’re comparing to a NVMe, a SATA drive won’t come close to these speeds but I believe most laptops these days use NVMe drives.

    Regardless, if you’re loading games off a USB 3.2 gen 2x2 interface, and assuming you’re using a single drive to a single controller (keep in mind that performance is split between connected devices per controller, and PCs often only have a couple controllers at most to manage all the ports), your read performance is probably more than enough.

    Scary_le_Poo, avatar

    I said “Internal SSD” not NVME SSD. So some description fail on my part, I meant SATA SSD.


    Ah, most laptops these days ship with an internal NVMe, so that’s what I assumed you were comparing against. A USB 3.2 gen 2x2 enclosure will vastly outperform a SATA SSD I believe, again assuming it’s the only device connected to your controller.


    incomparably slower than most hard drives

    Than most Solid State Drives you mean, since Hard Drive Disks have way slower read speeds than USB 3.0/3.1, I even have proof, My partners BG3 game was laggy as hell in her hard drive, but it’s manageable to play in an external SSD connected to USB3.1. The read speed changes from 35MB7s-ish to 500MB/s-ish iirc. it was VERY noticeable. Her laptop is a gaming laptop bought 4 years ago, and the processor/grapphics card works pretty well still, but the 250GB SSD is just not enough to manage windows and all the other games/programs, and the HHD is way too slow, so yeah. In the future changing the SSD to put a bigger one would be the best but for now an external drive works wonders.


    Compared to a HDD, yeah USB 3.0 speeds aren’t too bad, but most laptops being released these days use an NVMe for storage (or possibly even a soldered drive). My comparison was around what you’d expect in a laptop purchased in the past year or so.

    For your partner’s laptop, getting better read performance from an external drive doesn’t surprise me, but there are also limits to this. Games are starting to support DirectStorage, which allows the GPU to directly read and decompress assets from the hard drive. This won’t work with an external drive (at least from my understanding), so those games will likely fallback to much slower methods of loading assets if they support the laptop at all. This is also not taking into account the other hardware on the laptop, which might have been excellent for the time, but with how much CPUs and GPUs have advanced over the past 4 years, I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re starting to reach their limits with today’s major releases.

    silvercove, in The Steam Deck is changing how normies think of gaming PCs.

    It’s also changing how normies think of Linux.

    Also it basically doubled the % of linux users at Steam.


    Normies don’t think about Linux. You don’t even need to see Linux if you use a Steam Deck.

    CorrodedCranium, avatar

    Even so it made it significantly harder for people to make the dated throwaway comment that you’ll lose access to a majority of your games by switching to Linux.

    With that I feel like people will see it’s just as usable as MacOS and Windows in a majority of circumstances.


    You can use crossover and it isn't awful, but I think Mac is third for gaming at this point.

    CorrodedCranium, avatar

    I’m not too sure. I used to browse /r/MacGaming despite not owning a Mac but I lost of track of things when they killed 32 bit support


    There are some games that get official Mac ports, and that's nice, but compatibility on the rest of your library doesn't just work out of the box.

    Like I said, crossover is OK but when Mac's biggest strength is ease of use, fiddly manual configuration to make your library work isn't awesome.


    I lost all my games when I swapped to Linux.

    But that’s because it was a decade ago, and I was way too lazy to figure out why wine wouldn’t work, tho I don’t really pc game anyway and these were mostly older games, even then. Small loss.

    I know there’s a lot of stuff either native dev or ported/cracked for Linux, just never really spent the time to look into it.

    The only thing that’s going to cause problems for me now is idk how Linux handles vr. I assume not terribly well, since none (almost none?) of it is native dev. I’m looking to move away from consoles now that they are moving away from physical media (no point collecting if there’s nothing to collect), so Linux being more robust is great! But vr maybe my stick point. Depends how well developed it gets I guess.

    CorrodedCranium, avatar

    VR headsets and games with anti-cheat software still have issues. I haven’t been able to get Oculus Rift S to work for example.

    I think some headsets like the ones made by Valve and HTC work better though. I’m not sure if there’s currently the same degree of rapid advancements for VR Linux gaming as there are for gaming in general on Linux. I know OpenHMD exists but I haven’t tried it out myself.

    shadowbert avatar

    My Vive Pro does work - but not as nicely as it did on windows. Driver support for stuff like reprojection doesn't seem to be there.


    Yeah that’s kinda what I was expecting.

    I don’t really have a vr setup right now (have a psvr, the tracking sucks but I want to like it) but I was thinking maybe an index at some point…

    Tho tbh if I need to keep a windows pc for that to work… I can… I won’t be thrilled for it, but my laptop is touchscreen and running 11… idk how Linux does with touchscreen so I haven’t changed it out yet, probs could upgrade the hardware to game off it.

    CorrodedCranium, avatar

    Have you tried using the PSVR on your computer?


    Not yet, but I looked into it before I bought it and I’ve seen that it can be done as sort of a viewing unit? If I understand correctly that’s all it would be, which is still probably a powerful tool, but I just got the vr like a month ago and then immediately got two surprise kittens so I have not had time to play at all, much less do anything fancy with it.

    However if you want to tell me all about it, I am more than happy to learn from a person rather than an impersonal article. Really.

    CorrodedCranium, avatar

    I would have linked an article. I haven’t experimented with it myself but it seems like there’s one paid project available through Steam that aims to support the PSVR


    No worries.

    It’s a thing I’ll probably do at some point. Just for kicks. I’m a big fan of playing around with hardware to save money 😁 but it’ll probably be a while before I get to it. I have some self hosting and automation to learn to do first (not super knowledgeable presently, but omfg is the fediverse helpful with tech stuff 💜)

    CorrodedCranium, avatar

    Me too. Messing around with hardware is something that’s always stuck with me from when I was a teenager. If you give the PSVR thing a test mind messaging me or commenting so I can hear how it goes?


    I was also messing with hardware/software starting in teens. Grew up during the brief period in which home computers were fairly common though still quite expensive, but pc repair shops weren’t really around.

    I will try to remember, but it might not be for a while. :)

    callyral avatar

    Normies¹ don't even really think about Windows or OS in general, most people just think it's just what a computer is like regardless.

    ¹ : Normie as in person who is not experienced with computers and PC gaming


    I was going to say I slightly disagree, but then I thought about it some more and realized they probably just see it as SteamOS in the same way Android doesn’t make people think about Linux either.

    ReverseModule, avatar

    Still, casual gamers did think Linux couldn’t game. It’s changing this opinion in the best way possible and that’s really important since Linux is the best OS. I personally think we still live in medieval PC times as long as Windows is the main OS used.


    Still, casual gamers did think Linux couldn’t game.

    The parent comment is right. Most people don't think about Linux. Ask a 'casual' Swtich owner what OS the Switch uses, and their answer is probably going to be pretty close to the answer that a similar Deck user would give.


    When some Microsoft simp makes unfounded claims about how you can’t game on Linux, we now only need to point at the Steam Deck.


    Thats because its linux only in a technical sense