Poob,

I want them to give up their wealth and power for the benefit of society. But they aren’t going to do that, are they?

atlasraven31,

A rare few do. They’re off limits.

DessertStorms,
DessertStorms avatar

If they still have billions to their name, they're not as good or generous as they've made you think they are.

original_ish_name,

Most of these people only have billions in stocks. 2 things would happen if they sold these stocks: the stock prices would decrease (leading to them losing a lot more money than they would plan) and other people (with worse entintions) would buy the stocjs so they control the company and then push anti consumer changes

Poob,

They sure aren’t. They give up their wealth, but by doing so gain more power. They get to decide what is important for the world by dumping millions of dollars in their favourite charities. Charities that they conveniently get to put their names on to feel good about themselves.

Ilovethebomb,

Can’t fucking win with you, can they?

Sylver,

No, because it is literally impossible to become a billionaire without exploitation.

Millionaire? Possible. Billionaire? No moral way.

Ilovethebomb,

Oh good grief, you really are a tedious lot.

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

try this for tedium.. if you don't understand that being a billionaire is unethical, you aren't human.. because that sentiment only grows from here, so you need to get used to it..

Ilovethebomb,

🙄

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

Vladimir Putin knows more fear than any man alive.. Elon is right behind him..

DessertStorms,
DessertStorms avatar

lmfao, right, because you complicit "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" are a real treat...

Here's a hint for you: no matter how much boot you lick, or how much you defend the indefensible, they're never going to know you exist and you're never going to be one of them, so you're not only humiliating yourself for nothing and shooting your own foot, but the rest of our feet, too, by allowing those who exploit us all (yourself included) to continue to do so uninterrupted while their hoards of pathetic sycophants fight their battles for them.

Clown.

Ilovethebomb,

Umad?

Poob,

I’m not quite sure what you’re missing. The entire premise of those post and this thread is that we don’t think billionaires should be allowed to keep their money and power because being a billionaire is morally wrong. Why would we let them “win?”

Nepenthe,
Nepenthe avatar

So they're not allowed to have the money...and they're also not allowed to donate it? Am I clear? Because that seems stupid, tbh.

The world worked a little better when philanthropy was encouraged for the tax break. It always will. They get their cute little name on a plaque, whatever. The money goes where it's needed.

This is not to say anyone needs to be able to make that much in the first place, but demonizing one for also getting rid of it is funny

TinyPizza,
TinyPizza avatar

I believe they're alluding to the wealthy funneling their money into foundations and other "charitable" endeavors as basically being a money wash that also comes with a lot of power to influence things. Their charity comes with strings and when you're talking about the vast sums they wield, it has the ability to derail other charities or efforts that may have been more focused on the actual task/problem. If NPR decides not to run a story critical of Microsoft or the Gates's because the Bill and Melinda Gates foundation are donors, does that charity still have a net positive effect?

Poob,

The money goes where they want it to go, which is frequently not where it’s needed.

And you are correct, they should not have the money, since they didn’t earn it. They also shouldn’t get to decide where it goes, since they aren’t suited to make those decisions. It should be taken from them.

gullible,

Behold, I am a pedant that agrees with you! However, I do believe that billionaires earned their money… in the same way that a plantation owner earned their terrifying hoard; using their complete moral depravity and means.

Poob,

See you call that earning. I call it stealing. When something is earned, it would be wrong to take it from them.

gullible,

Vikings earned their broadly spread genetics in much the same way, complete moral depravity and means. Just because something is stolen doesn’t make it unearned, and just because something is earned doesn’t entitle possession. Theft begets reprisal.

bloodfart,

Labor theory of value as applied to all human activity.

gullible,

Just examples to illustrate that earning, deserving, rightfully belonging, etc. aren’t necessarily the right words to use in this context, but I guess it could be seen as vaguely communist in the right light. More sociological than political, though. Tax the rich, jail the physically and sexually belligerent.

bloodfart,

it’s not a communist sentiment at all. labor theory of value is predicated on socially necessary labor not just doing any old thing.

what youre doing with those statements though is pretty disingenuous. the idea of earning comes from labor (it’s literally the germanic to english word for a laborer and their pay) and has always meant that the subject of the verb deserves the object.

you could argue that the raiding parties believed they had earned their spoils, but in a human culture that generally doesn’t hold that belief, saying it without that qualifier implies assent to the ancient raiding parties belief.

gullible,

Judging historic people by today’s morals just produces the opinion that everyone born more than 100 years ago probably deserved to have been gutted like the swine they are, which is exhausting but entirely true to modern standards. It’s just easier to think of them as amoral animals- the gazelle deserves the cheetah and vice versa by pure mechanics alone. Abelard castrated himself obsessing about the moral line, which was lesson enough for me.

As I said, I was just being a pedant for funsies. To phrase it another way, billionaires deserve their fortune but deserve its forfeiture a hundred times over. Deserve wasn’t exactly the right word so I poked fun while agreeing with their sentiment in its entirety. It was entirely disingenuous, and I said as much at the get-go.

bloodfart,

it really doesn’t unless a person renders that judgement outside of consideration of their experiences, world and circumstances.

in which case you could say anything about anyone for any reason and have it be perfectly acceptable.

PugJesus,
PugJesus avatar

It's not murder if there's a tribunal beforehand

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

then it's just great theater

RagTheMan,

I am a starving child and this is the last post I will see before I die. Goodbye

IronDonkey,

The prevelance of the “murder billionaires” mindset and other generally negative attitudes and suggested violent solutions to everything - even more often and more exaggerated than reddit - is probably gonna chase me off lemmy. It’s everywhere here. Even blocking all the explicitly political communities isn’t enough to keep it away. This platform has a lot of growing up to do, and I’m not sure if it’s gonna do it.

TinyPizza,
TinyPizza avatar

Glass half full, there's very little talk of murdering millionaires, so hypothetically things are looking up!

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

i suppose a millionaire would basically taste as good as a billionaire.. you'd probably have to eat a lot of both to be able to tell the difference..

TinyPizza,
TinyPizza avatar

Oh well, cat's out of the bag I guess. No good deed goes unpunished and all that. They're both gonna taste weird if we're being honest. If cocaine leaves a taste in someone, I'm guessing they both taste like that.

Still plenty of liquid in that glass, I'm gonna call it half full. Optimism!

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

If cocaine leaves a taste in someone

i'd imagine a desiccated sort of tangy experience on the palate.. probably a white wine.. have to see what's in the cellar..

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

can i have your stuff

ArcaneSlime,

Our stuff*

Sabata11792,
Sabata11792 avatar

You have to first open a shell company to handle the liability, don't worry you just bankrupt it to avoid all consequences and open a new one.

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

you're hired

gabe,

You wouldn’t last a day around gen Zers with that attitude bud.

TinyPizza,
TinyPizza avatar

So OP, I'm unsure how to ask this, but you wouldn't happen to be... Say... A billionaire would you?

kebabslob,

OP glow in da dark

Narrrz,

murder is murder... but some murders are definitely less... crime-y than others

DessertStorms,
DessertStorms avatar

Self defence isn't murder

atlasraven31,

They’re coming for you, whether you fight back or not.

theodewere,
theodewere avatar

coming for you? they're eating you right now.. they eat you every day, and will for the rest of your life.. every extra bit of you there might be goes into their bellies.. they've got it all tabulated already.. they know what sauce they're going to use..

DessertStorms,
DessertStorms avatar

Exactly, we're already just cogs in their money making system at best - some of us may die but it is a sacrifice they are willing to make...

Track_Shovel,

They can live, but it has to be on 60k a year, with all of their initial assets liquidated and used to support people in need.

moosetwin,

yeah i’m fine with that but not murder like a lot of people here say they want

Narrrz,

I think most of us start with the assumption that they'll never give up their stranglehold willingly, and move on to more practical solutions.

Aesthesiaphilia,

practical

Ah, teenagers

Narrrz, (edited )

what other pressure do you have the ability to put on a billionaire that they wouldn't find utterly laughable, if they even noticed it? but you can't buy your way out of death. sure, if the threat to their lives were to become credible, they could leverage their wealth to protect against it, but being surrounded by bodyguards at all times, having every rooftop surveyed for snipers before you go out to get coffee - these are things that disrupt their overly-cruisy existences. and the more people there are gunning for them, figuratively or literally, the worse their lives get.

and sure, if you off them, their wealth will just default to someone else. but if billionaires start dying left and right, their inheritants might just start to find ways to make sure their fortune stays a little shy of that magical 9-digit mark.

Aesthesiaphilia,

This is the teenager equivalent of telling Santa you want a pony

Seraph,
Seraph avatar

They need to make the choice: pay a lot more taxes, or take the second option. I'm not threatening violence, but as our society gets more desperate the targets on their backs get larger.

There are 756 billionaires in the US and 330 million of us. Once that becomes clear to people things might change, one way or the other. All other "culture wars" are noise generated to distract from this one.

AnarchoYeasty,

The end result of revolution is… For them to pay more taxes.

gabe,

Shameless displays of excess wealth is increasingly being met with more and more cultural hostility, especially amongst younger people. Gen Zers are highly likely to view people who flaunt their wealth or indulge heavily in luxury goods as being tacky or just generally negatively. The hostility as the climate crisis increases will only increase as well.

unfnknblvbl,

Former tax professional here. The problem is that the billionaires aren't really billionaires. Elon Musk does not have a quarter trillion dollars in his bank account. His net worth is calculated from what other people think his holdings are worth. He cannot be taxed on this.

Unless someone is game enough to pass legislation enabling taxation of "unrealised gains" (while not allowing credits/offsets for unrealised losses), billionaires will continue not paying their fair share of tax.

Aidan,

B

ivenoidea,

To a billionaire that fate is worse than being murdered.

TooMuchDog,

Look I’m all for taxing the wealthy, but saying we should force billionaires, or really anyone for that matter, to give up everything more than $60k/year is fucking laughably insane.

Nepenthe,
Nepenthe avatar

Why, exactly? Only two years ago, 37.9 million people were below the poverty line, which is only $20k/yr. And that's only counting the US. If we can do it, they can do it.

If those making over $60k currently cannot make it work when so many of their own countrymen have been doing so for their entire lives, perhaps we need to talk. If nothing else, I can give you financial advice.

xedrak,
xedrak avatar

Nice red herring. The argument was that demanding a billionaire give up all of their money and live on a relatively small salary is absurd, and nothing you said refutes that.

NullVertex,

60k a year is probably already too generous in most cases, make them live off of the equivalent salary of their lowest paid employee

Juice,

Sorry, I’m just hangry. Lab grown billionare meat just doesn’t have the same kick.

shiveyarbles,

Yes that’s ridiculous! Wink wink

Phantom_Engineer,
@Phantom_Engineer@lemmy.ml avatar

Haha jk… unless

PeachyMcPeachface,

My tummy has the rumblies that only billionaires can satisfy

bloodfart,

Well, OP, maybe you ought to look into the life and times of Pu Yi, an imperial ruler who was allowed to live out his natural life after his oppressive dynasty was overthrown.

alea,

sorry, are you suggesting that the republicans should have murdered a six year old

bloodfart,

i don’t think so. what makes you say that?

my suggestion was that the alternative to killing the powerful and oppressive (given pu yi was a figurehead and his willingness to go along with reeducation came from lack of material intrest as well as his own personal life) has already been figured out by the chinese communists.

Octagon9561,

Killing insects isn’t murder. It’s pest control.

original_ish_name,
Draedron,

Billionaires is a weird group of people to choose to speak up for.

Hextic,

They can afford protection.

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